News

Creative Assembly on 'The Unmaking of Carthage'
Posted: 18.12.2012 13:11 by Simon Priest Comments: 68
The latest developer diary from Creative Assembly for Total War: Rome II takes us behind-the-scenes as the studio talks about "recreating the famous Battle of Carthage." It's a balancing act, always.

They also disclose letting us control up to 40 units at a time, a tactical overview map for 'battle orientation' and where they're focusing next. I wouldn't have the Gaul to spoil it for you.

In the dev diary, they say how hard it is to be faithful to scale whilst making sure the likes of Carthage "fits into the context of the game." They admit trade-offs are inevitable.

At the end of the video they tease we'll be seeing the Creative Assembly horde meandering around the forests of Germania and Gaul as they turn their focus toward the barbarians. The faction of Carthage has been the latest officially confirmed for Total War: Rome II, which releases exclusively on PC in October 2013.

Comments

By SirRoderick (SI Elite) on Dec 18, 2012
SirRoderick
Dev diaries are a good thing! More of them please ^^
By herodotus (SI Herodotus) on Dec 18, 2012
herodotus
Hil-harious. Wouldn't have the Gaul....*cringe*. Exciting visuals and great looking tactical map. Might mean less scale in terms of the Strategic map, but that's evolution. Simply releasing "RTW" with better graphics would be a wasted exercise to my mind. Might be financially rewarding but also a missed opportunity to advance the franchise.
By SirRoderick (SI Elite) on Dec 18, 2012
SirRoderick
The game will speak for itself mate, it'll stand or fall on it's own merits!

That said I'm yet to play a game of Total War I didn't at least enjoy, so I can't help being pleased at them revisiting my favourite period of history. With any luck they'll have really pulled some lessons out of Shogun that will make this a well rounded game.

Also, please tell me they hired some AI engineers or something, that would be nice to hear.
By Kres (SI Elite) on Dec 18, 2012
Kres
Currently reading books by Con Iggulden about Caesar, his life & conquests. Really good books. And it is so gonna make me get into RTW2. But it isn't coming out soon so don't how much effect it will have...
By SirRoderick (SI Elite) on Dec 18, 2012
SirRoderick
Those books are pretty damn good! A fair share of fiction of course, but it really gives a good image I feel. Save the last book for release week :P

If you want to read up on a more historical sort of field, I would recommend Adrian Goldsworthy. Smooth reading combined with a mostly unbiased and balanced viewpoint, plenty of historical details as well. He did a biography on Caesar that I felt was pretty well constructed and illuminating.
By herodotus (SI Herodotus) on Dec 18, 2012
herodotus
Ditto on Goldsworthy, and just finishing "Legions of Rome: The Definitive History of Every Imperial Roman Legion" by Stephen Dando-Collins myself. Everything you ever wanted to know about the Roman military. Still, you can't go past Leviticus or Claudius for the best stuff, while a bit tainted by prejudicial editing.
Time to hit up the "Rome" TV series again as the time draws closer.
By SirRoderick (SI Elite) on Dec 18, 2012
SirRoderick
I'll give that a looksee then Hero, something to read on a lazy day perhaps :)
By herodotus (SI Herodotus) on Dec 18, 2012
herodotus
Exactly the right time, as that's when I leaf through my histories. About to re-read "Battle Cry of Freedom" by James McPherson, if this bloody heatwave doesn't knock me out first. At least I can identify with the soldiers sweltering in their heavy wool jackets.
I'll have to go look up the books you've mentioned Kres. Don't mind a bit of Fiction and have exhausted the books by Valerio Massimo Manfredi (and the film of his novel "The Last Legion" shouldn't put anyone off reading his novels).
By SirRoderick (SI Elite) on Dec 18, 2012
SirRoderick
Heat wave...oh riiiiight, you guys are facing the giant fusion generator this time of year aren't ya? It's a nippy 5 degrees here, quite comfy.
By herodotus (SI Herodotus) on Dec 18, 2012
herodotus
Muggy 29 degrees here, and it's only 7am. Brains slow down and tempers rise accordingly. Could do with a bit of Northern Hemisphere frosty gusts at the moment. So still here, even the air burns.
By SirRoderick (SI Elite) on Dec 18, 2012
SirRoderick
I'm that guy that would rather spend the summer in Norway rather than his winter in Egypt. So no thank you!
By nocutius (SI Elite) on Dec 18, 2012
nocutius
Is this supposed to be just one of the "historical" battles or is this part of the campaign? Something like Kyoto in Shogun?
By SirRoderick (SI Elite) on Dec 18, 2012
SirRoderick
I'm assuming a showcase/historical battle
By novapaddy (SI Member) on Dec 18, 2012
novapaddy
I played Total War Rome for a solid 3 years, and had to buy the game a few times as well, as I moved about quite a bit in those days. I've played all the Total War games and think they are by far the best in the whole business. Been off playing Paradox in the past 2 years, but Rome 2 will DEFINITELY make be return to Creative. ... I CANNOT WAIT!!
.. pity it's going to be nearly a year before I get my hands on it, but plenty of time to save up for a good pc, so I can enjoy all the features on MAX!... just going to watch that video again..and again..
By herodotus (SI Herodotus) on Dec 19, 2012
herodotus
Hey Nova good to see you back, but believe me the time will go quickly. I remember thinking the same of "ETW" when reading all the previews and looking at the mind-boggling pictures. Couldn't wait, and then it had arrived.
As to Noccy's question, I'm guessing that at this stage Carthage may just be a showcase Campaign, or mini-Campaign - much as the Continental American one was. "NTW" was just a series of smaller versions of that, and "TWS2" had "Sword of the Samurai" and such. I'd say Carthage will be along those lines, with more to come in DLC's.
But...I'm only guessing. I'd like to hear more on the naval warfare at this stage, particularly with Carthage.
By SirRoderick (SI Elite) on Dec 19, 2012
SirRoderick
Agree on naval warfare, it should be positively addled with maneuvering what with all the focus on ramming that the tactics had in those days.
By nocutius (SI Elite) on Dec 19, 2012
nocutius
Perhaps today IS a good day to die. Prepare For Ramming Speed!
The tactic seems to be pretty relevant far into the future :)
By Hammerjinx (SI Veteran Member) on Dec 19, 2012
Hammerjinx
I, Claudius is a great mini series, speaking of Romans. Not much talk of battles, let alone showing them, but it covers a number of the emperors of Rome and, while a dramatisation, is reasonably accurate to actual events.

The Conn Iggulden Emperor series was good. I liked the afterwords where he'd point out deviations from fact.

I read Gibson's Rome a couple of years ago. A little dry perhaps, but very interesting. Not the kind of thing you belt out on a day off though.
By herodotus (SI Herodotus) on Dec 19, 2012
herodotus
I actually based my first Uni assignment on "I, Claudius" by Robert Graves and was suitably remonstrated by the lecturer. Rightfully so, I might add. Had the cheek to even list it in the Bibliography:)
Even so a brilliant novel, and only bettered by it's sequel "Claudius The God".
By SirRoderick (SI Elite) on Dec 19, 2012
SirRoderick
Certainly a good one, but not really something I'd use on a Uni assignment you cheeky aussie :P
By the_fourth_horseman (SI Veteran Member) on Dec 19, 2012
the_fourth_horseman
*yawn* nothing groundbreaking so far. Really Really boring movie. The Carthaginians are a faction in the game. Wow. I mean, was there a way around them? Not to be unnessecarily sarcastic or anything, but c'mon...

It's still a long way till october 2013, so for the time being I'll refrain from heating myself up with circumstantial literature and the likes ... I suggest y'all do the same, to ease your suffering :0
By Kres (SI Elite) on Dec 19, 2012
Kres
Wow you guys heard of Con Iggulden. Of course, we got a decent community here don't we! :) Was a new name for me until I somebody brought the book and I started reading. Figured the guy is good and expected him to be at least somewhat known. Leaving the last book for right before RTW2 kicks off is a good idea! I'll plan that move! :)
By nocutius (SI Elite) on Dec 19, 2012
nocutius
Based on trends in the franchise I predict Carthage to be a DLC faction in the next installment.
The way downhill is still pretty long :)
By SirRoderick (SI Elite) on Dec 19, 2012
SirRoderick
Don't be silly Nocutius, they aren't THAT silly yet ^^

And Kres, you should know better than to be surprised :P
By nikola1010 (SI Member) on Dec 20, 2012
nikola1010
Biggest euphoria I experienced was waiting for Rome total war all those years back, coz that WAS a revolution in TW series. All others (especially M2TW) were a derivate of that game, same principle, just new maps, slighly better graphics, new maps and units, and engine overhauls. I do hope this will be a revolution, and I hope that developers took some good things from Roma Surrectum II, coz that mod is awsome, and made the game interesting after all these years...
By SirRoderick (SI Elite) on Dec 20, 2012
SirRoderick
I prefer Medieval II TBH...simply because of the improvements made and the more grounded-in-reality feel it had. Rome is still great fun though, did really need a mod for me though ^^
By herodotus (SI Herodotus) on Dec 20, 2012
herodotus
I'd have to disagree nikola only in that "M2TW" was a hugely anticipated title and delivered on the promises.
"RTW" though was a quite extensive evolutionary step for the franchise, one that has yet to be equalled. I've been playing since "STW" and only those two titles have delivered on their promises, as much as I adored "ETW" (heavily modded).
By SirRoderick (SI Elite) on Dec 20, 2012
SirRoderick
This is why I hope this will be a comeback for the series. The old sense of SCALE and diversity you got from Rome and Medieval II, together with the melee combat front and centre once again. Add on the best things from Shogun II, the richness of the whole setting, the increasing focus on characters and you have yourself a lot of potential.

If the execution is good this will be a 9/10 game for me. If it's also moddable, 10/10 :)
By nikola1010 (SI Member) on Jan 12, 2013
nikola1010
Herodotus, I don't see much special things about M2TW. Look at ranged combat, and how poor they made it. One unarmoured peasant unit gets hit by 4 units of crossbowmen, wich is some 480 arrows in one volley, and only 5 men die, and rest gets hit and continues gouing. If total war developers are so focused on historical accuracy, how can they for example, exclude counteris like Serbia and Bulgaria, wuch were regional superpowers in their brightest times, or Norway, and independent kingdom? Or Wallachia? Croatia also? Byzantines were made miserable in the game, with almost Serbian crest as a flag.
By nikola1010 (SI Member) on Jan 12, 2013
nikola1010
My bad opinion on M2TW aside, I think that most players will agree that Total War games miss one thing mostly: the ability for players to change the things on campaign map, like making pernament forts, settlements, relocation of population, make custom roads, defensive fortification lines (something like Hadrian's wall). And be done with the policy of one city per province, maybe divide a province to sub-provinces with their own capitals, so one can take just a part of the province. Also, I think that ethnic division of population should be included, and ability to have ethnic policies (like assimilation, relocation, colonization - everything that was done by Romans). What others think of this?
By herodotus (SI Herodotus) on Jan 12, 2013
herodotus
"NTW" attempted several of what you've mentioned, but overall it is a tall order when looking at a global map and incorporating real time battles into the equation. That is mostly left to modders, and if you'd played the TC "Rome Total Realism 6.0" or "M2TW"'s "Shining Steel" you'd have seen much more of what you've asked for realised. Even Darthmod's megamod for "ETW" changed conditions greatly and made the Colonial Campaign a lot harder.
As for building where and what you want, as I say I think that may be a tall order. "M2TW" was developed by CA (Brisbane), and was just up the road from me so I got to see a lot of it's development. Man they put a lot of work into that.
Without the Mod scene, the series would be nowhere near what it is, though.
By nikola1010 (SI Member) on Jan 13, 2013
nikola1010
I never used those mods, but they basically correct the developer's mistakes, then improve the game. Modders greatly enhance the gaming experience, and what I really dont like is they repeatedly make the same things that annoy the players. In TW forums since RTW lot of people asked for more cities in provinces, and it's 8 years that no one done nothing about. Even in Shogun 2 it's the same basic system. Great game, but same mistake. Good thing is that they (finally, after 10 or more years) raised the max number of units per army to 40, and that's god news.
I understand that it's a hard work to do, but it's unprofessional to make something rather average, and just leave it to the modders to make it work better. I mean, we all buy those games, and they get money from it, and we still have to modify them in order to make them work.
By nikola1010 (SI Member) on Jan 13, 2013
nikola1010
As for Rome Total War, I use Roma Surrectum 2 even today, and it's a great piece of work, they literally changed the entire map, and even expanded it further. It was a pain in the ass to install, but it was well worth it.
By Kres (SI Elite) on Jan 13, 2013
Kres
Well, can't wait for RTW2 mods...
By herodotus (SI Herodotus) on Jan 13, 2013
herodotus
Play "Rome Total Realism" Nikolai. The Grand Campaign starts with the dissolution of the Senate (so no such missions for a start) and Rome splinters into many Factions. The Macedonians figure prominently, even though in the twilight of their time. The first time I played it I thought I was literally playing a different, grander and as-close-to-perfect game I could find.
The wishlist on "TW" Forums is getting bigger and I have to say better so if much of what is asked for is not implemented in the final release of "R2", then I hope the Devs have the good sense to open the code up to the huge modding scene.

Anyway, I'm sure we'll all be heavily discussing the game, when of course we're not playing it.
By SirRoderick (SI Elite) on Jan 13, 2013
SirRoderick
I actually just downloaded patch 3 for RTRVII and I'm thinking I'll play Roma Surrectum II for a bit as well. Two mods quite similar in their ideas with quite a different execution. Both are magnificent :)

RSII of course, is something you can download on this site as well ^^
By nikola1010 (SI Member) on Jan 13, 2013
nikola1010
I downloaded RSII from here, but it's a big thing to get it working (for example if it displays eror .511, you have to do this, if it displays .612 you have to do that). Many erors overlap, and it took me several hours to track them all down. The thing I mostly like is the movement of army per turn, it covers real terrain one army can pass in 6 months, not like in vanilla, you pass 100km in 6 months, wich is silly. A snail can cover more ground than that.
By nikola1010 (SI Member) on Jan 13, 2013
nikola1010
By the way, did anyone played a game Imperial Glory? Same principle like total war games, has a map like Medieval and Shogun I, but time is like in Empire and Napoleon TW. Campaign map is much worse than TW, and overall economics, but battles were far superior than TW. You could go inside houses, wich was only made possible in E:TW, and soldiers bled when hit, wich is only made in Shogun 2 Blood Pack DLC last year. They also had very good naval battles, wich impressed me highly. Game is from 2005, and look how much it was ahead of total war series in those aspects. Also, you had to train officers who could lead limited number of units in battle, and as they progressed, they gained ranks and abilities, wich was only introduced in Shogun 2 (not ordinary traits like in previous TW series, but something you could directly influence).
By herodotus (SI Herodotus) on Jan 13, 2013
herodotus
Yes I bought and played the game shortly after it's release, having missed "War & Peace" due to having a crap PC at the time. Not a bad game, but limited particularly on the battlefield when taking cities. I found some battles particularly frustrating more than challenging, like taking Paris.
Another I'd suggest is "Napoleon 1813" if you can get a hold of it. Fight the 7 year war against or as Napoleon with France against the European Coalition. For screenshots:
http://www.neoseeker.com/Games/Products/PC/wargamer/

Incidentally, "Imperial Glory" is available on from GOG.com for $2.39 for this weekend only (usually $5.99):
http://www.gog.com/gamecard/imperial_glory
By nikola1010 (SI Member) on Jan 13, 2013
nikola1010
Well, it's 2005 making, and for it's time, I find it very good. Some battles were so tough, I won battles with only 1 gun crew remaining out of entire army. I didn't do much of siege battles, I used Russia and got to England, wich constantly rebelled against me, and I got bored after awhile. That game is only good for battles, campaign is rather lame.
By nikola1010 (SI Member) on Jan 13, 2013
nikola1010
Man, napoleon 1813 is very old, I dont think I can stand that very old graphics anymore :) Cossacks series are also very good by my opinion, but extremly hard, it takes a lot of thinking to sucssesfully complete the mission, and it strains you to the last soldier you have...
And I prefer to get old games over torrents, like Blitzkrieg, Warcraft II and III, and similar classics :)
By SirRoderick (SI Elite) on Jan 13, 2013
SirRoderick
Ah so you prefer to pirate them instead of buying them?
By nikola1010 (SI Member) on Jan 13, 2013
nikola1010
And I forgot to mention bad things the TW team did:
1)removed the internal trade (trade between player owned ports and cities)
2)removal of numerous resources from campaign map (only few remained like timber, tin, metals, marble, horses, wood and similar).
1st thing I mentioned really crippled the player's economy, and one has to rely on foreign trade in order to sustain it's treasury. And when you under embargo (like in shogun 2 when you go against the emperor), coffers run dry.
And 2nd thing also, RTW map was dotted with resources wich were used for trade, now there are only few ones left :(
By nikola1010 (SI Member) on Jan 13, 2013
nikola1010
Pirate them? No way. They're laying around, and it would be shame not to "pick them up from the ground" :)
By herodotus (SI Herodotus) on Jan 13, 2013
herodotus
Here we go again. Another controversial topic.
If games are for sale, no matter their age it is the only legal, moral and ethical thing to do to purchase them from the distributor who has access and has paid for the source (often providing extras). Otherwise, it is simply theft.

The grey area is for games that are no longer available - anywhere. Is this piracy? Strictly speaking "yes", but practically you cannot obtain them by any other means as they are no longer sold. You can't really pirate an IP that is no longer sold/supported or otherwise available unless the rights are still owned and registered. If they are, and most will be, then I'm afraid it is theft once more.
My thoughts on the subject anyway.

Reminder: SI Policy - we do not promote nor condone Piracy...period!
By nikola1010 (SI Member) on Jan 13, 2013
nikola1010
Ok, ok, I strongly support the SI legal policy, and it's support against the struggle against piracy, even if I never actually read them. Piracy is wrong, and we're all obliged to take action against it. I'm ashamed of the whole torrent incident, and i apologize to all SI members, World Press and game producers worldwide :)
By nocutius (SI Elite) on Jan 13, 2013
nocutius
You could go into politics :)
By herodotus (SI Herodotus) on Jan 13, 2013
herodotus
Is that Anton Drexler hiding behind the Geisha make-up?
By nocutius (SI Elite) on Jan 13, 2013
nocutius
What does a 1920's politician have to do with me :)

Most of our politicians are like that so I got my inspiration from the present, think Berlusconi clones :(.
By herodotus (SI Herodotus) on Jan 13, 2013
herodotus
He was the one who suggested a certain Herr Hitler go into politics as well - his politics:)
By nocutius (SI Elite) on Jan 13, 2013
nocutius
Nikola please promise me that you won't commit any war crimes if you decide to take my advice.
I'd rather you just cheat on your wife :)
By nikola1010 (SI Member) on Jan 13, 2013
nikola1010
Man, if I go into politics, I would be declared the worst dictator in 21st century by western world, and greatest statesman and patriot by eastern block, so go figure :)
And what's wrong with Berlusconi? He's 76, and bangs 20-year old girls every day. I want that kind of life in my 70's :)
By nikola1010 (SI Member) on Jan 13, 2013
nikola1010
And maybe a few under-aged ones, but that's besides the point :)
By SirRoderick (SI Elite) on Jan 13, 2013
SirRoderick
You know we have an edit function right? You double posted like six times on this page ^^

As for Berlusconi, there IS the part where he pretty much guaranteed the continued entrenchment of organised crime :)
By nikola1010 (SI Member) on Jan 13, 2013
nikola1010
Well, it's better to organized and disorganized :) But, of all european politicians, he's the most likeable. Yes, he had countless sex and corruption scandals, but he made jokes on everyone's account, especially his coleagues. *ADMIN DELETED*
Not like Angela Merkel, who only talks money, money, money, or other US and EU politicians who condemn Iran, Syria and recently deceased Gaddafi, and turn our attention from real problems.
By herodotus (SI Herodotus) on Jan 13, 2013
herodotus
"Take Barack Obama for example (young, pretty and sun-tanned)".

Treading on very thin ice, nikola. Future such remarks will be moderated.
By nikola1010 (SI Member) on Jan 13, 2013
nikola1010
What? that's not racism. If someone is member on a different race, that doesn't mean that we're all forbidden to make jokes on their account :(
Now, this is a violation of freedom of speech :(
By SirRoderick (SI Elite) on Jan 13, 2013
SirRoderick
Nono, you're perfectly free to say what you will and we won't press charges for it :)

Doesn't mean you won't be moderated on a privately run website though
By herodotus (SI Herodotus) on Jan 13, 2013
herodotus
Not going to argue with you. If you can't see the problem with calling American Aboriginal people "sun-tanned", then that IS a problem.
Let's nip this in the bud guys, or the thread will be closed.

Ps. "Freedom of Speech"? This is not America.
http://img35.imageshack.us/img35/4932/censorshipw.jpg
By nikola1010 (SI Member) on Jan 14, 2013
nikola1010
I don't see a problem, but I'll play by your rules. By the way, black people actually can get sun tan like we do, but it's much harder to notice, since their skin is darker than ours :) And I'm not being racist by saying this, it's a scientific fact :)
By herodotus (SI Herodotus) on Jan 14, 2013
herodotus
I think you know what it was I was getting at (using sun tan as alluding to skin colour), and believe me "our" rules are far more lenient than anywhere else.
I know Aboriginals, no matter what ethnicity, do get tans or burns and having worked in a cancer unit I know they are far more likely to develop skin tumours simply because of the melatonin levels in the skin.

Anyway, we are WAY off topic so we might just let this thread die and hope no one feels discriminated against by any of us for any reason (comments OR rules).
By nikola1010 (SI Member) on Jan 15, 2013
nikola1010
Fine by me, I'm here for video games, not for "racism" :)
By Chosen_One (SI Elite) on Jan 17, 2013
Chosen_One
Ahah, this made my day :) Now we cant speak about colors of skin :) SI became like USSR, many absurd in their policy :) And twisted of power some of persons here. ^_^
By herodotus (SI Herodotus) on Jan 17, 2013
herodotus
Read the posts more carefully Chosen and you'll find you're very much mistaken.
Let the thread die, please.
By nikola1010 (SI Member) on Jan 17, 2013
nikola1010
We'll oblige the wishes of comrade Herodotus, comrade Chosen One :) It's his 5th request for this so far :)))
By SirRoderick (SI Elite) on Jan 17, 2013
SirRoderick
For heaven's sake you guys really do like prodding the bear don't you?
By Chosen_One (SI Elite) on Jan 17, 2013
Chosen_One
Hero, wasn't he just only quoted Berlusconi? And no one deleted his words from mass media :) It is a pity that you are unable to moderate Silvio's words in the first place :D
By herodotus (SI Herodotus) on Jan 17, 2013
herodotus
Yes well, there's a special place reserved in Hell for Berlusconi. As for here, I've yet to moderate anyone so fair's fair.
Anyway, back to the business of gaming.